starter Problems

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Tue Aug 26, 2014 12:43 pm

Hi.

I am experiencing a challenge cranking my engine. The starter doesn't engage.
I used the same starter without problems prior to an accident 5 months ago. I used the same starter well to crank the engine on the floor during my tests on my recent rebuild.
Any hints on what to check on. I suspect a wiring issue on the car.
Any leads to what I could check? I was suspecting poor grounding but didn't get any different results from a ground cable clean up.

Help!!!

Blue Baron · Post by **Blue Baron** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:58 pm

Test the starter in the car by crossing the battery cable connection on the starter to the solenoid wire connection with a screwdriver. If it cranks, you need to add a hard start relay. (I add the relay to all my VWs regardless.)

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:36 pm

Blue Baron,

The test didn't yield any much result. The starter solenoid threw but starter didn't rotate.

I got a new battery cable and relay as well. I'll replace and feedback on results.

I don't know anything about a hard start relay...kindly educate me. What I got is of similar value to what was. I bet it might come in handy (hard start) especially before I replace my carburettor that has a disfunctional chock system (..... what a fun journey this has been and still is- getting my bug into the desired shape!!)

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:48 pm

Hey Blue Baron,

I googled about the hard relay... Well undrestood.

Cheers.

darzoom · Post by **darzoom** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:14 am

More than likely a wiring issue. Makes sure you have a good connection from the main power wire on the light switch. If not tight you will have the issues you are talking about. I had that issue that the car would just die and found the large spade connector broken on one side. I replaced it and was well. Also, if you have a bad ground strap from the body to the frame horn there will be an issue as the starter gets the ground through the mounting bolts. I also had a hard start kit for the longest time but corrected the wiring issues and it was no longer needed. You are learning a lot on VWs for sure. Please keep us posted of your progress.

Blue Baron · Post by **Blue Baron** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:39 am

If he crossed the connections and the starter didn't crank, it's an issue with the starter itself, OR a bad starter bushing in the bellhousing.

darzoom · Post by **darzoom** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:05 am

Agree Blue. I was just going on his comments that he had cranked it when out of the car and all worked fine when wired directly from a battery with both positive and negative connections. In the car the negative goes through the car and if a bad ground the start has trouble getting what it needs to make a connection. Its all fun troubleshooting.

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 2:09 pm

Hey, Blue,

Kindly let's pick it from the point of a faulty bushing in the bellhousing. Having done all trouble shooting, it might be likely that is the problem. I have changed cables and tried the starter independently....and it works fine.. When back onto the bellhousing, it jams once engaged.

Kindly assist on the rectifying proceedure.

Regards.[/quote]

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:55 pm

Hi.

Case closed.
I found a messed up starter bushing. Fortunate, I had recently purchased a new bendix which came with a bushing that is the exact size to fit in the bellhousing (only realized/remembered it....good thing I stored it well. I now think intention was that one replace the bendix as well the starter bushing).

Thanks to you all. The car cranked perfect.

Blue Baron · Post by **Blue Baron** » Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:53 pm

Good news.

Usually if I talk enough, sooner or later I'll hit on the solution. This goes for my friends' cars as well. Recently I told my buddy to check on something he thought wasn't the problem, and sure enough it was.

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:00 pm

Hi.

I was slapped by a rude silent key kick....nothing. I removed the starter, everything looking ok...but wont even crank on a direct connection to the battery.

I stambled upon this video talking about a 3 post solenoid.... Could someone kindly explain the concept behind this? ....particularly the part they say they get solenoids working??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n2eOwhG1gU

I just don't know what happened....and what to do next!!

KKV270 · Post by **KKV270** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:15 am

Hi.

kindly inform me of the specific size of the bellhousing starter bushing aswell as the one that goes in the bendix (what I got fit well on the internal diameter but seem to be large on the external diameter)

I opted to change my starter after my old one just went dead.....not sure why. on placing the new one, it fits in tight ang struggles to rotate. the bushing I placed in the bellhousing is the reason.

please assist

hercdriver · Post by **hercdriver** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 6:36 am

KKV270 wrote:on placing the new one, it fits in tight ang struggles to rotate. the bushing I placed in the bellhousing is the reason.

Are you certain you bought the correct replacement? 12 volt starters use a different flywheel. A 12 volt starter on a 6 volt battery would turn much slower. The bushing normally comes with a new starter. If it doesn't fit, I would suspect that I have the wrong starter or an inferior replacement.

I'm a little late to this conversation, but I did want to add a few questions. I realize some of this has been addressed previously, but it seems as if the the problem has changed and I thought we should cover the basics.

1. What is the condition of your battery? 6 volt/ 12 volt? If you have 12 volt battery and starter, was your flywheel converted to 12 volt? The 6 volt flywheel has 109 teeth, while 12 volt flywheel has 130 teeth. Have you had the battery tested for voltage and cranking amps? Is your generator/alternator charging the battery (putting out >7 volts/>14volts)?

2. Did you have the old starter tested to confirm it was bad? Did you change the bushing? If so, how and were there any problems?

3. Please be precise as to what exactly the problem is. No rotation, slow rotation and cranks, slow rotation and cranks only a few times, odd noises, noises after starting, does the engine run smoothly at idle, etc.

We need to figure out if this is a battery, ignition switch, starter, starter solenoid, bushing, starter bendix, etc.

Blue Baron · Post by **Blue Baron** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 11:35 am

What starter busing came out of it? The 6-volt starter and transmission used a larger starter bushing, and the later 12-volt starters and transmissions used a smaller one. There is a special busihing you can buy with the larger outside diameter and smaller inside diameter for using a 12 volt starter in a car that originally came with 6 volts (I have one on my blue '66), and that sounds like it could be your problem.

If your car is 12 volts you can do away with the problem entirely by installing a self-supporting starter from an Automatic Beetle.

As for the three-prong solenoid, that's what I refer to as a hard-start relay. Basically it cuts power directly from the battery to the starter solenoid, bypassing the route the power normally takes from battery to starter cable to voltage regulator to headlight switch to ignition switch and finally back to the starter solenoid.

The hard-start relay works with the ignition key. A cheap and simple alternative is simply a starter button mounted in the panel under the back seat that connects the 12-volt terminal directly to the prong on the starter solenoid. Turn on the ignition with the key and hit the starter button.

darzoom · Post by **darzoom** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 11:51 am

There should be a section dedicated just to starters as this discussion has come up multiple times in the last couple of years.